If You Are Wealthy Enough to Afford "Conservation!"

by Liberty and Power

Check out the 100 miles to the gallon Hybrid GM Hummer for those who really want to"save" on gas! And, note the huge batteries in the Hummer, which will someday have to be somehow recycled, or disposed of.

No price offered as yet, on the
Hybrid Hummer.

Sort of like the Al Gorean folks who, 4 years ago, paid about $7,000 more for a futuristic,"greenie-looking," Toyota Prius, when they could have bought, as the NYT noted in 2005, a Honda Civic Hybrid (I did so) for much less. The mileage difference was so small, it would have taken years, and hundreds of thousands of miles of driving, to recoup the price difference. (And, the Honda was slightly larger and had more interior room, than the Prius.)

One never ceases to marvel at what Americans conceive of as"Conservation!" (On his own properties at the time, Gore was using enormous amounts of electricity, far beyond the average American's usage, but, then, he was, and is, out to"save the entire Earth," as he constantly reminds us all.)

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William Marina - 4/20/2009

Mr. Hunt,
Thank you for pointing out the spelling error. I was leaving on a trip when I wrote the piece, and never looked again at the title,

B the way, it was an accidental grammar error, and not a spelling one.

Finally, I see no post where you made any substantive comment on my logic or reasoning.

1. The expensive Hummer, with its huge batteries, that will have to some day be disposed of, is a strange way to conserve gas, or anything else.

2. The Honda Insight was an early hybrid entry to cheaply do so, as was the Civic. The new Insight is even more so.

3. Toyota, in the Prius, made a briliiant decision to offer a futuristic body design that really appealed to the "greenies," who bought it with enthusiasm, despite its overall operating cost, as noted in 2005 by the NYT, or the terrible mechanical problems associated with the early models.

Mr. Dresner did make some comments about the above, but is rather confused about the data, in my view.

William Marina - 4/20/2009

In an earlier comment I mentioned the mechanical problems of the early Toyota Prius, which came out years after the Honda Insight.
These were really serious. A friend of mine had one, and it just plain conked out in the middle of traffic. Toyota gave him another one, which later did the same thing, damn near getting him killed.

At that point, he got rid of the car, no longer impressed with the futuristic body design and not much caring about claims that the mechanical problems had been solved, which was true.

William Marina - 4/20/2009

The point is the Hybrid Hummer's overall cost is such that will will save little, if anything, with respect to the environment, especially with the huge batteries.

I did not attack the earliest hybrids, in which the Honda Insight, was much earlier than the Prius, which had a very high cost that took years to recoup in gas savings.

If Honda was first, how could Toyota or Gore have in any prior sense affected anything?
The market has decided, it appears, that the Hummer is a Bummer.

The newest Honda Hybrid has virtually the same performance level as the Prius at much less cost and has been selling very well.

Toyota was clever in futuristically styling the first Prius, which had some real mechanical problems which were finally corrected, so that those, like Gore, who wanted an "environmental" image were willing to pay for a car that overall was costing quite a bit more than other hybrids.

I have no idea what you are talking about with respect to siblings. I guess you are unhappy I have a cousin, not a sibling, from whom I can buy a car virtually at cost.

Lester Hunt - 4/19/2009

Isn't your spelling any better than your ability to reason in a straight line?

Jonathan Dresner - 4/18/2009

Why don't you ask Mr. Marina what the point of his post was: he's attacking early adopters for being early adopters (and for not having the foresight to set up their siblings in useful retail trades) and for spending their money on their principles, instead of acknowledging that early adopters help define markets for new technology and that the "Goreans" created the economic and political environment in which Honda was willing to invest heavily in producing his car and in sufficient quantities to make it more cost-effective.

Oh, and I read an analysis (might have been referenced in the freakonomics blog; I really don't remember) which suggested that there would be more benefit in carbon emissions savings, at least, to raising the mileage of low-mileage vehicles than high-mileage ones.

So, what's your problem with the Hummer, again?

Lester Hunt - 4/18/2009

It shows more respect for readers and for the others who post here.

Aeon J. Skoble - 4/18/2009

Is your point that Honda would not have come up with a hybrid if it hadn't been for Toyota?

Jonathan Dresner - 4/18/2009

PS: My cousin is a Honda dealer and I get them at cost!

Oh, is that what "free market" means?

William Marina - 4/18/2009

The Honda did exist.
Honda's new, inexpensive futuristic "Insight" existed much earlier but was too small. I did know a guy who nursed it to over 100 mpg.
Not only was there the Civic, but also an Accord, V-6 Hybrid, which my wife drove. Not only did it get about 35 mpg, but was the most powerful Honda made, and would really scream if you hit the gas pedal hard.
PS: My cousin is a Honda dealer and I get them at cost!

Russell Hanneken - 4/18/2009

4 years ago? Sure.

Jonathan Dresner - 4/18/2009

If all those people hadn't bought the Prius, would your Civic even exist, much less be economical?